Triangle Update--11Feb2008--Comments

Triangle Update

11 February 2008

Comments

Heather Kahler of Thatcher…

My take on why more people showed up for the fence hearing and to the meeting unfortunate resident who would "dream so big" as to enclose a small roof deck (I am so sorry everyone ganged up on you in such an unneighborly, controlling manner), as opposed to a meeting for the 30-story complex. The thoughts behind not attending may likely be that "will what I say make any difference to these big developers and the city officials who are so happy to obliterate every safeguard that was in place for the Marina, the coastal Commission/plan, etc. Probably not" and approvals will continue to turn us into NYC anyhow. With 2 meetings within one week of each other, and not being able to attend both, I had to make a choice.... for which one would my energy be most likely to pay off and actually have an affect? Time and time again, we squawk, we say "no", we protest, we petition, these BIG DEVELOPMENTS, and our desires get trampled. Our energy put forth feels as though it becomes completely ineffective with these big developers and city officials. I am not saying one should employ or that I employ a defeatist attitude, but when forced to make a choice about which meeting to drag my toddler and school age child to on a school night after I worked all day.... I chose the fence meeting, as I felt at least my energy might pay off. I WILL be sending written correspondence to the address listed regarding the 30-story monstrosity, and I encourage all of those who did not attend to do the same. There is a deadline of Feb 1st I believe to send correspondence. Reta, can you please put a link to the proper web site/email? I have to find it myself (yes you are the neighborhood sitter) also perhaps a reminder of this correspondence deadline could be circulated in the update.

Glenn Bartels of Route 66…

Always interesting reading here... and am I to understand that the
California government (city or local) spent money to do a year long
analysis of the size of peoples hedges and has then elected a task force
to enforce hedge height!
Please tell me I've mistaken something in my reading here and that our
California tax dollars are not being wasted on pernicious nonsense!!!!

Comment: This was a task force appointed by the Land Use and Planning Committee (LUPC) of the Venice Neighborhood Council (VNC). Everyone remarks about the height of fences and that nothing is being done, etc. The task force did something. So now, perhaps, the LUPV or VNC will go forward with the grass roots recommendations to the City. Perhaps, it will be six feet. Enforcement without a proper rule doesn’t work as all have witnessed.

Kevan Jenson of Howard…

The quotation "good fences make good neighbors" is from the poem "Mending Wall" by Robert Frost.
A character in the poem utters the adage in an unthinking adherence to social strictures. Frost is critical of the phrase saying: "Something there is that doesn't love a wall" and "Why do they make good neighbors?"
Venetians and Del Reyers might read the poem before advocating tall hedges and fences.

DeDe Audet of Thatcher…

Reference to history given at VNC meeting regarding fences.

Now, as to your premise. I Googled some of the issues and was quite surprised to find that what you wrote is what you found.

Sorry pal, L.A. was not settled by Europeans with thoughts of Mutual Rights or Social Utility. It was a Spanish religious settlement. Urban homes in Spain are usually sequestered by high walls. Right here in Venice is Zanja Street, the path along the ditch. It runs south of Venice High where zanqueros, ditch watchers, took care that water was distributed equally. In those days, Venice was mainly a swamp and part of a Spanish land grant. Today, north of Santa Barbara, there are still Spanish land grants that run from far out to sea up to the top of the ridge that overlooks the Chumash Indian Gambling Resort.

When I was a kid, coming south to California with my grandmother, I recognized the distinctive style of Spanish architecture. It was exotic. I recall the courthouse in one city where beautiful rugs or tapestries were hung over the rails of outside stairways---landmarks of an arid climate. My grandmother told me it was not called a courthouse. It was a Palace of Justice. Wow.

Back in the nineteen twenties in downtown L.A. businessmen wore lightweight sport coats and broad brimmed Panama hats. Out in Hollywood a flannel blazer with a black or navy blue T-shirt was hot. Women wore fluttery, pastel dresses and big straw hats. The black and gold Shell building stood out like a sore thumb and the Englishmen coming out of there for lunch were all dressed alike in proper gray flannel.---stuffy, stuffy. The Kansas and Iowa picnics were really, really big events. And that, in my opinion, was the advent of the front yard in L.A. Almost all of the housing tracts that extended L.A. made use of front yards. The earliest ones even made use of the huge front picture window, a staple of Midwestern residences. And lawns!

Adventurers, forget Chinatown, went to gather snow water from the big mountains to water the lawns of the tract houses in L.A. This was totally out of sync with the arid climate. So the imposition of front yards and lawns was an import from places with plentiful rain. The flat roofs designed to reflect the sun's rays off the houses were supplanted by steeply peaked roofs appropriate to shed snow. Lawn mowers sold well.

The energetic Iowans and Kansans built a world-class harbor. Get that. They made a harbor where none existed before. And L.A. grew and grew. So I do not buy your view of yards in L.A. as Mutual Rights or Social Utility as a European concept. In the European cities I visited, I did not see a lot of front yards visible to all. Most of the houses in the cities I visited had no yard at all. Of course those houses were built long after the time when property owners built fences to keep the neighbor's cow from trampling the turnips.

Now, one more visit to my past. When my pals and I played softball in the street, we learned that some homeowners did not appreciate kids trampling over their rose beds to retrieve balls. It could get so severe as to have a policeman come to the house. It was even rumored that some pater familias had squared off against a complainer. Owners of homes following the Spanish custom of high walls never had to deal with this problem.

Please look to courtelage (curtilage) and the common law, which is the pattern for our law, and how trespass, invasion of one's person or property, evolved. After all, the United States follows the common law of England and our language of English embraces the concepts, which evolved as the language, developed. As a contrast, consider the Napoleonic Code, which is the basis of most European law.

Commons, the land shared by all is still with us. As Challis pointed out to me, homeownership extends out to the middle of the road in front and to the middle of the alley behind. That land is shared for a common purpose. So what is this right to a view line?

This is what brings me to the Second Commandment: likenesses, images, and whether a passerby has the right to photograph or video my family or me on my property.

Ask any celeb.

Thank you for tackling the subject. It is a matter deep within the psyche of all of us. And your depiction could well be the best way out. As I am sure you are aware, representation is an issue with me. Some of the critics at Tuesday night's event asked by what right the VNC board represented their views. Yes, well.

Challis MacPherson, committee chair for LUPC and of Howard…

She was asked where to get info regarding 31-story building slated to be built in Triangle.

31-story building info go to: http://cityplanning.lacity.org/eir/MDRTowerProj/Deir/PlattMarinaDEIR.htm...

Richard Meyers, Venice Neighborhood Council…

Thanks for your coverage of the fence issue. I just wanted to follow up on your statement, "I think the Venice front yard fences would make a terrific photo book." It's been done as a gallery show by Susan Rennie, if not yet a book, check out this link: http://venicenc.org/node/649

Carol Bolander of North of Rose Group…

I feel very offended by the meeting at Westminster in that I certainly received no notice before 4:00p.m. on Tuesday and due to work obligations only heard of the meeting the day after the meeting. I have placed my name and email address on the VNC roster twice and still do not receive any direct notices of meetings. If they put themselves in a place to decide on community issues, then I think ALL members of the community should be notified in a timely manner so they can attend if they wish. Any decision made involving my property, when I was not informed in a manner that would allow me to give my opinion, I feel would not be justified in expecting me to comply. After all, this is still presumably, on the surface at least, a democracy!

Rick Selan of Penmar Park…

Why did VNC take on this whole fences and hedges project in the
first place? Rather than wasting time on fences and hedges, which
the home owners nor police would never enforce, why doesn’t VNC
consider a project to house the homeless, similar to Santa Monica,
through grants, There are enough non-profits in Venice and the
resources of VCHC and St. Joseph's that this project might not be
that difficult. If the progressive forces push the issue of
homelessness, the progressives must work with the whole to solve this
serious homeless problem.
Venicians work too hard on their gardens to have a VNC Police
force go after them. I feel strongly that those who rent feel just as
strong as those who own homes on the right to privacy and to cut down
on noise.

Rand Denny of Windward Circle area…

I received a call from our Senior Lead Officer today alerting me to the
newest theft they are seeing a LOT of in Venice right now. People are
stealing catalytic converters out of vehicles. Apparently a catalytic
converter has platinum in it and that's why they've become desirable to
thieves. I was told that they are being stolen MOSTLY (but not entirely)
from Toyota Trucks, like Toyota 4Runners etc. He did say that they are
also being stolen from other smallish trucks. Within the last week+ they
have had around 15 stolen. If you have a small truck, or know somebody
that does you may want to give them a heads up. And if you're involved
with another neighborhood watch group or association please pass this
along to your members.

Elizabeth Wright of Berkeley…
Neighborhood Watch involvement is easy, informative, and important.
There are quarterly meetings in which the bock captains are presented
with a talk on a topic of interest, and an opportunity to learn what
the crime trend is and whether it is heading our way. LAPD is more
than willing to work with our neighborhood to set up a neighborhood
watch group. If interested, just show up at a meeting.
The neighborhood watch meetings held by LAPD will be
Thursday, February 28, 2008 at 6:30 p. m.
Thursday, May 15, 2008 at 6:30 p. m.
Thursday, August 21, 2008 at 6:30 p. m.
Thursday, November 20, 2008 at 6:30 p. m.
at the LAPD Pacific Community Police Station
12312 Culver Boulevard, L.A at the southeast corner of Centinela and Culver.
The main telephone number is (310) 482-6334.

reta moser