GRVNC Election Committee Minutes
March 21, 2004

 

1. Call to Order, Tom O'Meara

2. Joan Leonard, League of Women voters, question and answer session.

Tom introduced Joan Leonard. .
Questions posed by Joan:
How many of attendees voted in First election?
2 raised their hands.
How many of attendees voted in Second Election?
4 raised their hands.

The floor was given to Joan Leonard from League of women voters:
Joan discussed the flaw in the ballot design of the first election, which was caught in time but made the counting difficult.

The turn out in the second election was good but had no election committee meetings.

A discussion of absentee ballots collected after election has closed during second election. There were complaints regarding that. No procedures were communicated about absentee ballots availability or timing during second election.

First election there were no absentee ballots.
Second election, a committee of two decided to have absentee ballots.

Joan said that absentee ballots require a neutral P.O. Box. Or outside party.

Joan mentioned Julie Rashin’s (League of women voters) had a great influence and contribution in the Eagle Rock trouble, which was a totally legal but unethical raffle tickets given during election.
She mentioned that Hollywood had a good election.
She mentioned that the election was seen as being taken over by scientologists, which own a lot of buildings in Hollywood. But she said that the scientologists were all stakeholders.

A discussion of absentee ballots being great for larger participation, but not if they are collected after the election.

A discussion of the standards (or requirements) to vote in person versus absentee ballots.. To vote in person, you had to show proof of stakeholder status, unless you were already registered or had a GRVNC card. To vote as absentee, you did not have to show proof of stakeholder status.

A discussion to require people to be qualified if they do absentee ballots was discussed. A Xerox of driver’s license to be sent in with request or pre-registration.
The other alternative is to stop registration for everyone.

Paul discussed that those who pre-register don’t require ID during Election Day ,versus those who register during Election Day must show ID.
For those who vote by mail, they don’t have to prove their stakeholder status.
There were third party requests during the second election. One person requested 30 absentee ballots to be sent out to individuals. Only one person should send out a request of absentee ballots for themselves. The individual’s signature should match the absentee ballot returned form. This is done during the counting process of absentee ballots.
A concern regarding sending e-mail requests for absentee ballots was raised and how they know that there aren’t duplicate votes? Joan answered the question of duplicate votes. She said they check the signatures to assure this didn’t happen.

The question of pre-registration or sending in proof with registration for absentee votes was discussed again.

Bill asked if there were a high percentage of absentee votes?
Answer: Yes, approximately 800.

Joan indicated that more active communities need absentee ballots.

A discussion of who is qualified to request an absentee ballot. In the past, there was stipulation that a person who is incapable of getting to the election poll. In downtown, it has to be a shut in or someone who can justify that they can’t go to vote.
Joan indicated that it was like that in CA but two years ago, it changed. Anyone can request an absentee ballot with no reason given. There are 42% absentee votes now.

A discussion of how to verify that people didn’t move. Is there anything in bylaws regarding verification that a person still lives at the same address? No bylaws regarding that. On Mon. night, there will be a board meeting to discuss provision to bylaws regarding who is stakeholder. The board can approve the changes.
A discussion regarding homeless people and where to mail voter registration packets. A question of whether you can be a member of multiple neighborhood council was raised?
Darryl raised the question of being a psychologist and having patients in different places?

A letter to city attorney whether homeless can be members of meetings? Also, if felons can be members? The answer is yes.
In granda hills, there was an issue whether BFI can be on committee. Every neighborhood has their council to decide what is right for them.
The question of who is a stakeholder and who gets to vote has never been solved. Joan indicated that it could be a very long discussion.

Joan discussed the questions raised in the last election which were as follows:.
- Can homeless vote?
- Can felons vote?
- Can anyone under 18 votes?
The reply was yes to homeless and felons but no one under 18. There are restrictions to voters under 18.
Most neighborhood council allow below 18 years old to vote. Joan said that 16 years and above, even 15 years and above can vote.
Most neighborhood councils have a youth involved. In Echo Park they said young people could vote. 10 kids less than 10 years old voted.
St. Joseph can bring in homeless from many cities to vote if they have a vested interest.
Fred Dewey asked what if St. Joseph has the biggest Easter feast of the year and asks everyone to vote for their vested interest issue. It would be fraud if they did it. The issue is trying to get more people to participate and vote, since participation is usually on the low end.
Joan indicated that city attorney said yes to undocumented aliens and convicted felons voting.
An example of BFI having many employees and setting up geographic zones to vote. This is a protection against taking over the elections. Discussion of setting up geographic areas and people voting in the geographic area they live or they are allowed to vote in one area of their choice.
The issue with the first election is that all areas were listed and people can vote in one of each.
This needs to be addressed in procedures and have to amend the bylaws.
What can you do in election?
Joan: We don’t have two years to rehash this. Bylaws limit voters in each geographic area.
Joan suggested color-coding the ballots so it won’t be a nightmare.
Discussion of who is a stakeholder took place. A stakeholder is someone who lives, works or own property. This neighborhood council will not prohibit anyone that owns property to vote. Homeless from outside (other cities) can’t vote.
Establishing a stakeholder as one that works in the area is a policy question. Should it be defined as “main place of business”? If a resident and lives in property which geographic area would they vote in? Answer: cities self define this. The voting process is based on an honor system. A resident isn’t an issue. Other people self define since they aren’t asked for proof.

A scenario was presented: what if democrats have their headquarter in Venice. They can stake the election.
Joan recommended talking to BONC about this. They had one meeting on the same issue in downtown.

Joan said that jail could be a stakeholder? The answer is yes.

Erma said that in Marvista, things are based on the honor system. They need to encourage people to have part in city council.

The election is opened and planned in advance gives people confidence in the election process.
Joan raised questions as what do people in Venice think of the election?
She recommended that as a committee they discuss the validity of the votes. The issue frequently stated is negative attitude towards the election without thinking of fraud.
Part of the communication to the public is what you’re (council) is doing differently this time.
Fred asked: Do we have the resources?
Reply: Communication through local paper and e-mail to 1500 people. Also, information can posted on website. Joan commended the website which was designed by Tom O’Meara. The logo was designed several years ago.

The issue of apathy & public not caring was raised.
Joan stated that it takes too much energy for fraud. She mentioned that BFI had a board elect president who can vote in one place.

Ron said that the board, not the election committee, addresses the major hard-core issues.
Joan said that cities want to empower neighborhood council.

The issue of who is a stakeholder will be discussed on Mon. 3/22 by the board.

Ron asked what type of inputs / suggestions does the election committee have? Discussion of current bylaws defining stakeholders and the committee will define it in their meeting. Everyone was encouraged to attend the meeting on 3/22.
An example of two neighborhood councils with same geography competing. One lost and sued.
Members showed concern that they want issues to be in the interest of Venice (since each city is different).
Joan said she lived in Sherman oaks. She lives in once zone and shops in another zone. Which zone should she vote in? She indicated that there are no bylaws in Sherman oaks to define that.
Everybody should be treated fairly. Committee can allow a vote for one geographic area. Certain reps. of stakeholder groups can vote. Discussion of changing stakeholder from geographic to residential geographic. Public have to self define. If anyone votes, they have to have an address. The neighborhood council has a geographic rep. Discussion of bylaws. A person can vote if they lived or rent in an area. Business gets a different ballot. An ‘at large’ ballot for anyone who doesn’t live or rent.

Darryl: How the individual got many votes?
Carol: Should discuss one of the alternatives? Example. One district gets a blue registration card.

Paul encouraged the committee to decide if they want these bylaws to change. Most council with geographic districts self define which areas to vote in.
If someone is voting, they can do it in the area they live in or have business in only. Not self define which area to vote in but the address will define.

Example by Joan about getting the temple bulletin with an address that connects her to the area, which is different from where she lives. She can self define where to vote.
An example of the Echo Park Philippines social club was given. People identify with the organization.
Fred raised the point about what if he has a poetry reading at “beyond baroque” and asks for everyone (who was sent a newsletter) to vote.
Darryl suggested going to the Bonk meeting.
Joan: There is a degree of honor system in the election process. Deal with it as issue if Fraud comes up. Getting people to participate is a problem. No current issues of unqualified people voting.

Paul: Absentee ballots were an issue.
Some of the candidates went out and encouraged people to vote through absentee ballots. There is an issue of credibility of the election process.
One person who was voted in was unseated by credibility.
It took six weeks before the count was announced.

Joan stated that the absentee ballots were all counted at the same time.

Recommendation is to get people to vote absentee before the election and each individual request their own absentee ballots.
Paul: The neighborhood council has no criminal or legal rights to go after someone with perjury.

How do you know if a person still lives there?
Mail registration before the election and ask for it to be returned if the person has moved.
E-mail: One person can request absentee ballots for several as long as each individual form comes back signed by one person with ID.
Council has to decide if they want to do that or hand out application.
Joan: In the past election, there were some absentee ballots that were controversial since they didn’t know how they got absentee ballots. These were thrown out.

Issue: How to know if people are still qualified? Have 30-day outreach.
Irma: Are we making it more difficult?
Paul: No, we’re protecting the rights of the stakeholders.
Bill: The goal is to include many people. It could potentially get over complicated with 7 districts.

Joan: It isn’t hard. Set up 7 different tables and each person goes to the right area to vote. Something about this way makes you vote more important.

Bill: The honor system makes sense.
Joan: Vote by honor system is in CA. There is always room by Fraud.

Paul: Federal law prohibit that you show ID.
Joan: You can ask for address. Not ID.
Bill: I’d like to operate with the idea of citizen involvement. Assume people will be honest.
Some people agree. Most council is like that.
In Venice, Granada Hills & Echo Park, there are factions.
How do you set up structure?
Joan: By zones and electing officers.
Joan: A possible voting procedure is by true majority before taking a seat. It prevents factions. The problem with this is there is no history behind it. The total vote is small versus the community size.
In Venice, there were approx. 1600 votes out of 40K in community, including children. There were 2500 registered.
Paul: There is a proposal to make anyone automatically registered in Venice, if they are registered in CA. The information of who is registered is accessible from the city.
Council thought it is a great idea. Everyone is encouraged to go to the board meeting on Mon. and show their approval.
Joan commended Paul for being a great resource.
She indicated that there is an opportunity to look at the geographic area issue and Paul can be a liaison. The committee listens to him.

Joan: What will encourage people to give credence to the council?
Reply: Present geographic areas, register, and give address and then vote in that district.
In bylaws, change ‘live’ to ‘stakeholder’.

3. Approval of Minutes of last meeting (tabled)

4. Approval of Agenda:

5a) MOTION: Moving Item 6t up to just after 6b)

Maker: chair, Second: ?

Tom	Erma	Fred	Darryl	Ron	Bob	Bill
A	Y	Y	Y	Y	Y	Y

motion passes

5b) MOTION: Table item 6b)

Maker: Chiar, Second: ?

Tom	Erma	Fred	Darryl	Ron	Bob	Bill
A	N	N	N	N	Y	N

motion fails

 

6a) MOTION: Resolve the ambiguity of the GRVNC bylaws with respect to the membership of comimttees to state that the chair of the Elections Committee shall determine the committee's voting members and request that the board, when creating committees in the future, decide if that committee's voting membership is to be set by the new chair.

Maker: Chair, Second: ?

Tom	Erma	Fred	Darryl	Ron	Bob	Bill
A	Y	N	Y	Y	N	Y

motion passes (with protest by Fred who thought there should have been more discussion)

6b) MOTION: No Venice stakeholders were present at the meeting to ask to become a member of the committee. No action taken.

6c) MOTION: To declare the elections committee now has enough members, and that the diversity of Venice who have who last names starting with "D" and "N" were given a chance to volunteer, and that a further effort was made to allow claims for diversification of the committee, but none came to ask for inclusion.

Maker: Ron, Second: Bill

Tom	Erma	Fred	Darryl	Ron	Bob	Bill
A	Y	Y	Y	Y	N	Y

motion passes

 

6t: Motion-Article 4, Sub D.
… 7 officers shall be elected “who live” change “who live” to “who’s a stakeholder”
Darryl suggested: “who reside, own property, do business”. “vote for one district”.
Stakeholder status discussion: members who live, work or own property or participate regularly in an organization….Ron & Darryl motion correction: “live, own property or own business”
Decided to take no action and leave bylaws, with respect to who votes for district reps, as “live in,” but really implement "live in" with the elections rules this year.